Full Tilt Poker Game #6860720732: 250 Play Money Sit & Go (52142709), Table 6 - 120/240 - No Limit Hold'em

Seat 5: Shamus5 (3,345), is sitting out
Seat 6: ertrauma (6,749)
Seat 7: SimonClick (35,387) (playing LAG, often showing less than optimal showdowns, big suckouts got his chips for him)
Seat 8: Doyle-Tx (3,210), is sitting out
Seat 9: bjshipley (21,228)
SimonClick posts the small blind of 120
Doyle-Tx posts the big blind of 240
The button is in seat #6
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ertrauma [Jd Jh]
bjshipley folds
Shamus5 folds
ertrauma has 15 seconds left to act
ertrauma raises to 525
SimonClick calls 405
Doyle-Tx folds
*** FLOP *** [5h 6d 4s]
SimonClick checks
ertrauma bets 1,290
SimonClick calls 1,290
*** TURN *** [5h 6d 4s] [Ad]
SimonClick has 15 seconds left to act
SimonClick bets 4,560
ertrauma has 15 seconds left to act
ertrauma raises to 4,934, and is all in
SimonClick calls 374
ertrauma shows [Jd Jh]
SimonClick shows [Qh 2h]
*** RIVER *** [5h 6d 4s Ad] [7c]
ertrauma shows a pair of Jacks
SimonClick shows Ace Queen high
ertrauma wins the pot (13,738) with a pair of Jacks
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 13,738 | Rake 0
Board: [5h 6d 4s Ad 7c]
Seat 5: Shamus5 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 6: ertrauma (button) showed [Jd Jh] and won (13,738) with a pair of Jacks
Seat 7: SimonClick (small blind) showed [Qh 2h] and lost with Ace Queen high
Seat 8: Doyle-Tx (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 9: bjshipley didn't bet (folded)

__________________
ertrauma


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
As my father always said, "Son, choose your sword wisely for some day you may find you must fall on it".

Against a LAG player you really need to make it more pre-flop. Usually with a LAG player, they are re-raising or calling depending on their cards (or desires...), no matter what the open raise is (within reason of course, 3x-5x imo). LAG players like to see flops, and so you need to make them pay more to see them.

Your opened for about 2.2. Thats far too small. At the least it should be 700'ish imo. I probably make it closer to 1000.

The flop bet is fine. The turn call depends on the player. If he had shown that he would bet scare-cards like this, then I snap it. If he was only LAG in the sense of drawing, then I probably find a fold.

er,
First of all I always tell people not to play at the play money tables. It's a waste of time if you are serious about improving your game. I think for every hole you fill there you pick up 2 more. You would be much better off playing the smallest cash games or tourneys.

I don't know how small the games go on FullTilt but I believe the cash games on Pokerstars start at .01/.02 and I know they have tournies that start at $1 or so. In my opinion you would learn so much more quickly at these small games. Here's why - at the play money tables people play differently than they do when there is even a very small amount of cash at stake. Even at .01/.02 the play is much closer to real world play than at the "free" tables.

I'm now stepping off my soapbox...

Shoving pre would have been a huge overbet. It would have been that classic case where you probably only get called when you are beat or when it's a race (AK, AQ). You would have been risking 6,749 in chips to win 360.

I agree with never_race on the pre bet size. A bet of about 900 or so would be about right. On the flop you'd have about 2000 in the pot with 5800 or so behind. Considering your read on your opponent it would be nice to get it all in on that flop. After his check, I'd try something that might look like a continuation/feeler bet of about 1500. If he reraises you, you then shove (If he flopped a set or a straight, oh well). If he just calls you have 4300 behind and about 5000 in the pot.

When the A falls on the turn you must let your poker instincts do their job. I have something that I usually tell myself, "Bad players will play any Ace." But still, if your read is right, a LAGtard is probably doing exactly what he did on the scare card and you probably have to push at that point and just pray to the poker gods.

Cheers!

Would echo the sentiments re: play money tables. I did a little experiment after a bad run where i played the play money SNGs just to prove that even against total donkeys the games are beatable. When I went back to $2SNGs I had to adjust my play considerably. I think that players at any level can be consistently beaten, but it makes more sense to invest $100 in a bankroll that will be more than enough to get you started in $2 SNGs mixed with the occasional $1 MTT for fun and variety. Personally, now that I play $5 and $10 SNGs, if I play a $2 one I don't really put as much effort into it, so I either play at my usual buy in or don't play at all. I have to admit, the play money 90 man SNGs are fun when you are wasted.

lol, yeah I gotta admit that as well.

play money is the devil, it just seems to me you get a good hand push and pray! good luck to you!

as above.....
how do you add a quote..

Never_Race said
"Against a LAG player you really need to make it more pre-flop. Usually with a LAG player, they are re-raising or calling depending on their cards (or desires...), no matter what the open raise is (within reason of course, 3x-5x imo). LAG players like to see flops, and so you need to make them pay more to see them.

Your opened for about 2.2. Thats far too small. At the least it should be 700'ish imo. I probably make it closer to 1000."

the other reason you must raise more pre flop is to make sure the big blind doesnt get the right odds to call with rubbish and get lucky.
With a hand like JJ you want to be heads going into the flop.

oh, big blind sitting out - didnt see that.
with the dead big blind money to pick up as well even more reason to increase bet size pf.

What can you do? As stated earlier, raise more pre-flop. Don't be upset to take the pot down pre-flop. It is better to win a small pot than to lose a big one. You won this one, but I would say nix any opening pre-flop bet less than 3x the BB from your poker arsenal. If you can't raise the correct amount than your hand is too weak.

__________________
"You will succeed far more by capitalizing on your opponents mistakes than you will by the greatness of your own play." --- I am not sure who said this but it is a great quote and piece of advice.


Colorado Players Click Here

Hi ertrauma,

With the BB sitting out, there is much to attract a LAG in the SB to see a flop, but although JJ is a great hand, it is not a great hand ... the general feeling is that "Jacks are only really useful when you have a flat tire" but against a LAG they will do fine if you are called, given their canyon-like range of hands they play.

Your raise should be about 4xBB given the BB is sitting out. Going all in with JJ is not really an option here, because the objective is to get some of those chips. You do not have KK ... you have JJ ... and JJ is not the holy nuts, it is just a good hand. I liked the way the pot played out and you deserve the chips, even though the board started looking scary.

With the micro-limits available on a number of sites, there is no real reason not to open a (small) account. The main reason you should do this is that the poker play becomes a little more rational. It is a sad truth that Play Money poker is loose to the point of obsenity, and IMHO ... will hurt your game. "Real" poker players do not play that way. The second reason is that opening an account, albeit small, makes you eligible to play in freerolls and promotions that are challenging and fun. Challenging because even good players play, and fun because there is a real money prize which keeps people on their toes in the game.

Your game play was not that bad. It is really tough arguing bet size in a play money game when most play money players act like caffeinated squirrels raising with abandon at the drop of a hat.

Good luck in your games!

__________________
flintsword

"The lucky player is usually the player that knows how much to leave to chance."

Blog www.myspace.com/flintsword