In case you missed it, read this first: Wynn Poker Tournament in Las Vegas: Part 1

When your not involved in a pot, its important to pay attention, there is a lot to be learned just by watching.

Here are a couple examples of some plays that took place in pots that I wasn’t involved in, there are some important concepts here that I will try and explain.

Blinds are 25 & 50, betting rounds of 50-100

Seat 7 Limps in middle position with 7-8 hearts
Seat 8 Limps in with queen-jack of hearts
Seat 1 Limps in with Ace-X (anything)

The flop is: Ace of Hearts, King of Hearts, 3 of Hearts

Both seat 7 & 8 Check (marginal bad play for seat 7, I think betting here is more correct with a flopped medium size flush, I hate checking and having another heart come and losing to the ten of hearts or jack of hearts when they may fold if you bet on the flop.) (semi-ok play for seat 8 who flopped the nuts and could not be beat at that point). Seat #1 Bets in last position and both Seat 7 & Seat 8 flat call, which is a horrible play in my opinion, especially for seat 7. Either player should have check raised

The Turn: 5 of hearts (making 4 hearts on the board)

Seat 7 checks (which is ok, because his flush probably got counterfeited), Seat 8 who has the best hand and can’t be beat checks again. This is just a horrible play, he has both the queen and jack of hearts, meaning the 1st best flush card and 2nd best flush card are out of play. Does he really think the 1 seat is going to bet again? He should have bet, I understand he was trying to check raise, but this play just isn’t going to work even against the dumbest of dumb players. The best play in this situation is to always bet out, and get the money in the pot by not missing a bet. It’s Limit Hold’em, you will most likely get called, players hate folding in Limit Hold’em and often pay just to see your cards

The River: Some insignificant black card

Seat 7 checks, Seat 8 bets (finally), Seat 1 folds, Seat 7 reluctantly calls, and then we get to see the cards. This pot should have been bigger, Seat 8 cost himself at least 3 small bets, and two big bets

Lesson to be learned (a):

If you flop a medium size flush, bet your hand (in this case he would have still lost, but maybe based on the flop action, when the 4th heart hit on the turn, he could have had enough information to fold

Lesson to be learned (b):

Slow playing is almost never correct in Limit Hold’em, build the pot and win more money, your more than likely going to get plenty of action anyhow. If you have the nut flush cards on a 4 card suited board, bet your hand, it’s incredibly unlikely someone else is going to bed, and more than likely that one (if not more) players will still call.

Part 3 of the tournament story continues here:

Wynn Poker Tournament in Las Vegas: Part 3

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I'm Not Lucky, I Have Good Karma !

The QJ, if he check-raises here, the only player that would call is the smaller flush is it not? The smaller flush would likely be trapped, married and go all in, but it's not statistically likely that there will be a player with a smaller flush.

I agree that he needs to raise somewhere, else he doesn't no for certain where he stands, and he's missing bets. It's not entirely unsafe to bet the nuts in the first place, as most people aren't going to assume you really just bet the nuts, of course you'll have to change that habit up as you go.

I just think that a check raise, especially at a table with some inexperienced players is to strong of an action, and will scare out two pair and other possible callers.

If you are going to check raise, it seems to me you ought to wait until the turn or river, so that you're getting big bets in, rather than just the small bet if the table does fold up around you.

You may have a point, but I see players make bad calls all the time, especially in Limit Holdem. If the late postion better flopped two pair he definitely wouldn't fold, and may even raise. Again, sounds goofy and illogical, but I see this type of play all the time from bad players. Most of the time, they won't fold top pair in this spot either (at least bad players). The small flush is trapped into calling for sure.

Bingo ! I often bet out when I flop quads, full houses, flushes, etc. Players never want to believe you and they think your just trying to buy the pot (because in their own minds if they flopped the nuts, they would slow play the hand or some other non-genius play).

One of the first lessons I learned when I moved to Vegas was get rid of FPS (Fancy Play Syndrome). Most often the correct play is to bet your hand, straight forward and directly. Poker really isn't as complicated as some people make it be.
A valid point, but with 3 suited cards on the flop, if another card of the same suit falls on the turn or the river, it will spoil your chance for a check raise(like it did in the hand above). I'm a big advocate of getting the money in with the best of it, you never know when a player will go crazy when your holding the nuts.

Jason

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I'm Not Lucky, I Have Good Karma !

I don't play limit hold'em often, but I agree slow playing doesn't really benefit you.

I can tell you know quite a bit about poker by all your posts around the forum. Just curious...when you're at the casino, do you talk to the others like you know a lot about poker, or do you try to play it like you're an average poker player?

There's no profit in educating poker players at the table. Zero, none, nada, zilch.

And there's no profit in letting others know your an expert. I try to blend in, keep the game friendly and the tourists and bad players entertained.

Not educating or teaching the bad players at the table is one of the most important lessons to learn. The whole idea is to play with bad players, the worse they play, the more you make.

Jason

__________________
I'm Not Lucky, I Have Good Karma !